[TI] Catholic church ban on Mormans accessingSacramentalrecords.

Tue May 6 13:53:42 CDT 2008

Sounds pretty obstinate to me.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gloria Otto" <gotto at ameritech.net>
To: <terminiimerese at comunesofitaly.org>
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 2:26 PM
Subject: Re: [TI] Catholic church ban on Mormans 
accessingSacramentalrecords.


> This does not sound good for genealogists. From the Catholic News Service: 
> http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0802443.htm
>
> VATICAN-MORMONS May-2-2008 (1,010 words) xxxn
> Vatican letter directs bishops to keep parish records from Mormons
> By Chaz Muth
> Catholic News Service
> WASHINGTON (CNS) -- In an effort to block posthumous rebaptisms by the 
> Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Catholic dioceses throughout 
> the world have been directed by the Vatican not to give information in 
> parish registers to the Mormons' Genealogical Society of Utah.
>
> An April 5 letter from the Vatican Congregation for Clergy, obtained by 
> Catholic News Service in late April, asks episcopal conferences to direct 
> all bishops to keep the Latter-day Saints from microfilming and digitizing 
> information contained in those registers.
>
> The order came in light of "grave reservations" expressed in a Jan. 29 
> letter from the Vatican Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the 
> clergy congregation's letter said.
> Father James Massa, executive director of the U.S. bishops' Secretariat of 
> Ecumenical and Interreligious Affairs, said
>
> the step was taken to prevent the Latter-day Saints from using records --  
> such as baptismal documentation -- to posthumously baptize by proxy the 
> ancestors of church members.
> Posthumous baptisms by proxy have been a common practice for the 
> Latter-day Saints -- commonly known as Mormons -- for more than a century, 
> allowing the church's faithful to have their ancestors baptized into their 
> faith so they may be united in the afterlife, said Mike Otterson, a 
> spokesman in the church's Salt Lake City headquarters.
>
> In a telephone interview with CNS May 1, Otterson said he wanted a chance 
> to review the contents of the letter before commenting on how it will 
> affect the Mormons' relationship with the Catholic Church.
> "This dicastery is bringing this matter to the attention of the various 
> conferences of bishops," the letter reads. "The congregation requests that 
> the conference notifies each diocesan bishop in order to ensure that such 
> a detrimental practice is not permitted in his territory, due to the 
> confidentiality of the faithful and so as not to cooperate with the 
> erroneous practices of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints."
> The letter is dated 10 days before Pope Benedict XVI's April 15-20 U.S. 
> visit, during which he presided over an ecumenical prayer service attended 
> by two Mormon leaders. It marked the first time Mormons had participated 
> in a papal prayer service.
>
> Father Massa said he could see how the policy stated in the letter could 
> strain relations between the Catholic Church and the Latter-day Saints.
> "It certainly has that potential," he said. "But I would also say that the 
> purpose of interreligious dialogue is not to only identify agreements, but 
> also to understand our differences. As Catholics, we have to make very 
> clear to them their practice of so-called rebaptism is unacceptable from 
> the standpoint of Catholic truth."
> The Catholic Church will eventually open a dialogue with the Mormons about 
> the rebaptism issue, Father Massa said, "but we are at the beginning of 
> the beginning of a new relationship with the LDS. The first step in any 
> dialogue is to establish trust and to seek friendship."
>
> The two faiths share intrinsic viewpoints on key issues the United States 
> is facing, particularly the pro-life position on abortion and an 
> opposition to same-sex marriage.
> However, theological differences have cropped up between Mormons and 
> Catholics in the past.
>
> In 2001 the Vatican's doctrinal congregation issued a ruling that baptism 
> conferred by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints cannot be 
> considered a valid Christian baptism, thus requiring converts from that 
> religion to Catholicism to receive a Catholic baptism.
> "We don't have an issue with the fact that the Catholic Church doesn't 
> recognize our baptisms, because we don't recognize theirs," Otterson said. 
> "It's a difference of belief."
> When issuing its 2001 ruling, the Vatican said that even though the Mormon 
> baptismal rite refers to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, the church's 
> beliefs about the identity of the three persons are so different from 
> Catholic and mainline Christian belief that the rite cannot be regarded as 
> a Christian baptism.
> Latter-day Saints regard Jesus and the Holy Spirit as children of the 
> Father and the Heavenly Mother. They believe that baptism was instituted 
> by the Father, not Christ, and that it goes back to Adam and Eve.
>
> Msgr. J. Terrence Fitzgerald -- vicar general of the Diocese of Salt Lake 
> City -- said he didn't understand why the Latter-day Saints church was 
> singled out in this latest Vatican policy regarding parish records.
> "We have a policy not to give out baptismal records to anyone unless they 
> are entitled to have them," Msgr. Fitzgerald said of his diocese. "That 
> isn't just for the Church of the Latter-day Saints. That is for all 
> groups."
> Though he said the Salt Lake City Diocese has enjoyed a long-standing 
> dialogue with the Latter-day Saints, Msgr. Fitzgerald said the diocese 
> does not support giving the Mormons names for the sake of rebaptism.
> Mormons have been criticized by several other faiths -- perhaps most 
> passionately by the Jews -- for the church's practice of posthumous 
> baptism.
>
> Members of the Latter-day Saints believe baptizing their ancestors by 
> proxy gives the dead an opportunity to embrace the faith in the afterlife. 
> The actual baptism-by-proxy ceremony occurs in a Mormon temple, and is 
> intended to wash sins away for the commencement of church membership.
> Jewish leaders have called the practice arrogant and said it is 
> disrespectful to the dead, especially Holocaust victims.
>
> "Baptism by proxy is a fundamentally important doctrine of the Latter-day 
> Saints," Otterson said. "We have cooperative relationships with churches, 
> governments -- both state and national -- going back to the last century.
>
> Our practice of negotiating for records and making them available for 
> genealogical research is very well known."
> Father Massa said he is not aware of aggressive attempts to obtain 
> baptismal records at Catholic parishes in any of the U.S. dioceses.
> He also said the Catholic Church will continue to reach out to the Mormons 
> and carry on the efforts of understanding that have already begun, 
> especially in Salt Lake City.
> "Profound theological differences are not an excuse for avoiding dialogue, 
> but a reason for pursuing dialogue," Father Massa said.
> END
>
> Gloria
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ---- 
> From: Joseph Laiacona <joseph at laiacona.org>
> To: terminiimerese at comunesofitaly.org
> Sent: Tuesday, May 6, 2008 12:57:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [TI] Catholic church ban on Mormans 
> accessingSacramentalrecords.
>
> As I believe it is practiced...
>
> the Mormons use the records to trace their family lineage. They have to 
> have
> proof that the ancestors they are submitting for baptism are actually 
> their
> ancestors.
>
> Once they prove that one (or more) of the names they submit are indeed
> ancestors, those ancestors are then joined by baptism to the church and
> therefore saved.
>
> It has nothing to do with saving strangers... It's their ancestors they 
> want
> to be with in Mormon heaven.
>
> Joe
> who is not a Mormon...
>
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